gnupic: Thread: Re: [gnupic] using Byron Jeff's TLVProgrammer

On Sat, Dec 16, 2006 at 10:04:09AM -0700, Maxim Wexler wrote:
> Hi group,

Hi,

> 
> Planning to use this programmer w/ pkp and 16f88 chip on a breadboard.

I believe there's a report of it working with pkp (that's the console app for
pikdev right?)

> .pkprc gives the settings for a "classical Tait programmer"; do these apply
> for the TLVP. Any caveats; I don't want to let the smoke out 8(

You won't let any smoke out I don't think. I find that you really need
to doublecheck the settings to make sure they are attached to the correct pins
and that the polarity is correct.

> For starters I'll try something simple like blinking a LED.

Drop me a line here or in my forum if you have any problems. I believe I have
an alpha version of picprog that works with the 16F88 too if you have any issues
with pkp.

Finally when you do get it working can you post a report to the forum? Thanks.

BAJ

On 12/16/06, Byron A Jeff ####@####.#### wrote:
>
> On Sat, Dec 16, 2006 at 10:04:09AM -0700, Maxim Wexler wrote:
> > Hi group,
>
> Hi,
>
> >
> > Planning to use this programmer w/ pkp and 16f88 chip on a breadboard.
>
> I believe there's a report of it working with pkp (that's the console app
> for
> pikdev right?)



Yeah, the gui keeps crashing but that's allright  if  I can get the same
functionality in Konsole.

FWIW here's a typical debug session for pikdev. Don't have a clue what it's
about just that it seems pikdev specific.

 Using host libthread_db library "/lib/libthread_db.so.1".
`system-supplied DSO at 0xffffe000' has disappeared; keeping its symbols.
[Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled]
[New Thread 16384 (LWP 14100)]
[KCrash handler]
#6  0xb5e7616c in memcpy () from /lib/libc.so.6
#7  0xb7395c9b in std::string::_S_construct<char const*> ()
   from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.3.6/libstdc++.so.5
#8  0xb7392319 in std::basic_string<char, std::char_traits<char>,
std::allocator<char> >::basic_string ()
   from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.3.6/libstdc++.so.5
#9  0xb7389c51 in std::basic_stringbuf<char, std::char_traits<char>,
std::allocator<char> >::basic_stringbuf ()
   from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.3.6/libstdc++.so.5
#10 0xb738b597 in std::basic_istringstream<char, std::char_traits<char>,
std::allocator<char> >::basic_istringstream ()
   from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i686-pc-linux-gnu/3.3.6/libstdc++.so.5
#11 0x0807cfeb in PicFactory::getPic (this=0x8234d90,
    picname=0x8234d70 "p16f628") at PicFactory.cc:102
#12 0x08060629 in BuiltinProgrammer::selectDevice ()
#13 0x080604c0 in BuiltinProgrammer::enter ()
#14 0x08087539 in PikMain::updateProgrammer ()
#15 0x0808a7df in PikMain::PikMain ()
#16 0x0807f116 in main ()

Maxim

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>

>
> You won't let any smoke out I don't think. I find that you really need
> to doublecheck the settings to make sure they are attached to the correct
> pins
> and that the polarity is correct.
>

 OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
TVLP page about that.  .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I? And another
thing: what does the hardware care what's in a file when I turn on the PS
before even starting the program?

<...>
# pins assignation : negative value means inverted signal
# the following values are correct for classic Tait parallel programmer
vpp=-5
vdd=-4
clock=3
datao=2
datai=10
rw=25
delay=0 <...>

Maxim

On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Maxim Wexler ####@####.#### wrote :
>
>OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
>TVLP page about that.

I wouldn't expect it to be in that form, necessarily.

>  .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
>important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I?

You have to obey the file format, but you can specify whatever your 
programmer needs. As I understand it, each line defines both the pin 
number and the polarity of a given signal. So the Tait definition reads 
as:

>vpp=-5

The Vpp enable control is on pin 5 of the parport (d4) and is active low

>vdd=-4

The Vdd enable control is on pin 4 of the parport (d3) and is active low

>clock=3

The programming clock line is on pin 3 (d2) and is active high

>datao=2

The programming data output is on pin 2 (d1) and is active high

>datai=10

The programming data read-back is on pin 10 (ack?) and is active high

>rw=25

I assume this means there's a read/write selector on the Tait 
programmer, on pin 25. Not all programmers have this signal.

If you have a pin-out for the TVLP you should be able to work out the 
correct values to put in the file.
-- 
Rob Pearce                       http://www.bdt-home.demon.co.uk

The contents of this | Windows NT crashed.
message are purely   | I am the Blue Screen of Death.
my opinion. Don't    | No one hears your screams.
believe a word.      |

On 12/16/06, Robert Pearce ####@####.#### wrote:
>
> On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Maxim Wexler ####@####.#### wrote :
> >
> >OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
> >TVLP page about that.
>
> I wouldn't expect it to be in that form, necessarily.
>
> >  .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
> >important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I?
>
> You have to obey the file format, but you can specify whatever your
> programmer needs. As I understand it, each line defines both the pin
> number and the polarity of a given signal. So the Tait definition reads
> as:

 >vpp=-5

___
any text book I ever read says this means minus 5 volts at vpp. vpp(5)
means vpp at pin five, naught.

>
> The Vpp enable control is on pin 5 of the parport (d4) and is active low
>
> >vdd=-4


ditto minus 4

The Vdd enable control is on pin 4 of the parport (d3) and is active low
>
> >clock=3


d3 on the parport is strictly i/o as far as I'm aware. And, it's ganged w/
the other i/o

The programming clock line is on pin 3 (d2) and is active high
>
> >datao=2
>
> The programming data output is on pin 2 (d1) and is active high
>
> >datai=10
>
> The programming data read-back is on pin 10 (ack?) and is active high


Looks like only one data line ie actually called 'data'.

http://www.finitesite.com/d3jsys/


>rw=25


Well, pin25 on the parport is gnd

I assume this means there's a read/write selector on the Tait
> programmer, on pin 25. Not all programmers have this signal.
>
> If you have a pin-out for the TVLP you should be able to work out the
> correct values to put in the file.


I've got the pin-out. Don't have your confidence. Which lines are for the
parport and which the programmer?

Maxim

On Sat, Dec 16, 2006 at 01:12:06PM -0700, Maxim Wexler wrote:
> >
> >You won't let any smoke out I don't think. I find that you really need
> >to doublecheck the settings to make sure they are attached to the correct
> >pins
> >and that the polarity is correct.
> >
> 
> OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
> TVLP page about that.  .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
> important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I? And another
> thing: what does the hardware care what's in a file when I turn on the PS
> before even starting the program?
> 
> <...>
> # pins assignation : negative value means inverted signal
> # the following values are correct for classic Tait parallel programmer
> vpp=-5
> vdd=-4

The two above should be positive. The 74HCT573 is a non-inverting buffer.

> clock=3
> datao=2

These two are correct.

> datai=10

So is datai

> rw=25

Not sure what this parameter is.

> delay=0 <...>
> 
> Maxim

On Sat, Dec 16, 2006 at 08:54:23PM +0000, Robert Pearce wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Maxim Wexler ####@####.#### wrote :
> >
> >OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
> >TVLP page about that.
> 
> I wouldn't expect it to be in that form, necessarily.
> 
> > .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
> >important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I?
> 
> You have to obey the file format, but you can specify whatever your 
> programmer needs. As I understand it, each line defines both the pin 
> number and the polarity of a given signal. So the Tait definition reads 
> as:
> 
> >vpp=-5
> 
> The Vpp enable control is on pin 5 of the parport (d4) and is active low
> 
> >vdd=-4
> 
> The Vdd enable control is on pin 4 of the parport (d3) and is active low

Both of which are the opposite on the TLVP. They are active high.

> 
> >clock=3
> 
> The programming clock line is on pin 3 (d2) and is active high
> 
> >datao=2
> 
> The programming data output is on pin 2 (d1) and is active high

These are correct.

> 
> >datai=10
> 
> The programming data read-back is on pin 10 (ack?) and is active high

ACK. that's right. and it's active high (or technically non-inverting).

> 
> >rw=25
> 
> I assume this means there's a read/write selector on the Tait 
> programmer, on pin 25. Not all programmers have this signal.

Pin 25 is a ground. So I'm real confused by this one.

> 
> If you have a pin-out for the TVLP you should be able to work out the 
> correct values to put in the file.

You can find it here:

http://www.finitesite.com/d3jsys/proglvp-terminated.gif

It follows the Classic Tait model. Substituting Vdd for MCLR and Vpp
for the LVP signal should work for the 16F88. Otherwise you may have to
reverse them. It's the sequence that's important and I don't have a 16F88
programming spec in front of me.

BAJ

On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Maxim Wexler ####@####.#### wrote :
>
>>vpp=-5
>
>___
>any text book I ever read says this means minus 5 volts at vpp. vpp(5)
>means vpp at pin five, naught.

But we're not talking electronics text books or circuit designs here. 
This is a configuration file for a piece of software - rather akin to 
that character in Lewis Carol, it means exactly what the author of the 
software wants it to mean. The syntax "<name> = <value>" is very common 
in software configuration files, so this syntax is a fairly obvious way 
to define the pin-out (and the polarity).
-- 
Rob Pearce                       http://www.bdt-home.demon.co.uk

The contents of this | Windows NT crashed.
message are purely   | I am the Blue Screen of Death.
my opinion. Don't    | No one hears your screams.
believe a word.      |

On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Byron A Jeff ####@####.#### wrote :
>>
>> >rw=25
>>
>> I assume this means there's a read/write selector on the Tait
>> programmer, on pin 25. Not all programmers have this signal.
>
>Pin 25 is a ground. So I'm real confused by this one.

D'oh! Sorry, I was mis-remembering. Since 25 is ground, I think this 
means the Tait programmer does NOT have a r/w control pin. The software 
could cope if it had one but in that case you'd not specify 25 here.

I think.

-- 
Rob Pearce                       http://www.bdt-home.demon.co.uk

The contents of this | Windows NT crashed.
message are purely   | I am the Blue Screen of Death.
my opinion. Don't    | No one hears your screams.
believe a word.      |

Le Samedi 16 Décembre 2006 23:44, Byron A Jeff a écrit :
> On Sat, Dec 16, 2006 at 08:54:23PM +0000, Robert Pearce wrote:
> > On Sat, 16 Dec 2006, Maxim Wexler ####@####.#### wrote :
> > >OK what about this from .pkprc, negative 5 for instance? Nothing on the
> > >TVLP page about that.
> >
> > I wouldn't expect it to be in that form, necessarily.
> >
> > > .pkprc is a commented list so presumably this is
> > >important info so I can't just put anything in here, can I?
> >
> > You have to obey the file format, but you can specify whatever your
> > programmer needs. As I understand it, each line defines both the pin
> > number and the polarity of a given signal. So the Tait definition reads
> >
> > as:
> > >vpp=-5
> >
> > The Vpp enable control is on pin 5 of the parport (d4) and is active low
> >
> > >vdd=-4
> >
> > The Vdd enable control is on pin 4 of the parport (d3) and is active low
>
> Both of which are the opposite on the TLVP. They are active high.
>
> > >clock=3
> >
> > The programming clock line is on pin 3 (d2) and is active high
> >
> > >datao=2
> >
> > The programming data output is on pin 2 (d1) and is active high
>
> These are correct.
>
> > >datai=10
> >
> > The programming data read-back is on pin 10 (ack?) and is active high
>
> ACK. that's right. and it's active high (or technically non-inverting).
>
> > >rw=25
> >
> > I assume this means there's a read/write selector on the Tait
> > programmer, on pin 25. Not all programmers have this signal.
>
> Pin 25 is a ground. So I'm real confused by this one.

It just means that this programmer doesn't have bidirectional data line
(as 25 is neither readable nor writable, pikdev/pkp does try to use it)
Under pikdev UI, this pin is tagged as NA (non applicable)

AFAIK programmers with RW line are rather unfrequent.
The only one I kwnow is ASIX picolo 

The delay=.. parameters allows you to slow down data clock,
to cope with noisy hardware.

Alain 


>
> > If you have a pin-out for the TVLP you should be able to work out the
> > correct values to put in the file.
>
> You can find it here:
>
> http://www.finitesite.com/d3jsys/proglvp-terminated.gif
>
> It follows the Classic Tait model. Substituting Vdd for MCLR and Vpp
> for the LVP signal should work for the 16F88. Otherwise you may have to
> reverse them. It's the sequence that's important and I don't have a 16F88
> programming spec in front of me.
>
> BAJ
>
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Ce message a été vérifié par MailScanner
pour des virus ou des polluriels et rien de
suspect n'a été trouvé.
MailScanner remercie transtec pour son soutien.